SPEAKER_03 0:08

Welcome back to the Thought Broadcast, the trainee-led podcast from Australasian psychiatry. Listeners would be aware that over the past twelve months, we have worked to demystify the scholarly project and humanize the research experience through a series of conversations. We have also played a role in facilitating communication between the Royal Australian and New Zealand College of Psychiatrists, otherwise known as the RNZCP, and its cohort of trainees on key issues such as the audiovisual OSCU failure and changes to the examination requirements to achieve fellowship. We'd like to take this moment to thank all the guests who have supported the podcast with their time over the past 12 months. This resource could not exist without you. All of our episodes are still available on the usual streaming sites. Browsing and listening back to the catalogue is highly recommended. Looking ahead to 2023, we have several projects in the works, which we are excited to share with you in good time. However, to start the year, we have the pleasure of introducing two new associate trainee editors to the Australasian Psychiatry and Thought Broadcast team. But firstly, let's welcome our regular panel members. We have Dr. Michael Waiteman from South Australia. Hi, Michael.

SPEAKER_00 1:12

Hi Ali, great to be back for another year.

SPEAKER_03 1:14

Oh, it's fantastic to have you here. And then as usual, we're also joined by Dr. Andrew Amos from Queensland. Hi Andy. Oh, that's good. We had previously been joined by Dr. Brian Bowie, who was also from Queensland. However, Brian's attentions have been drawn to other opportunities, so he'll no longer be appearing on podcast as a regular panel member. We'd like to thank Brian for all of his efforts in creating the series. His ideas were innovative and highly valued. And we wish him all the best for his future endeavours wherever you are. Brian. So, Michael and Andy, we have some very talented new voices to introduce. And the first of these is Dr. Ashna Basu. She's a first-year psychiatry trainee working in Sydney with special interest in gender equity, research, and governance. She's recently been recognized as a finalist for the 2023 New South Wales Young Woman of the Year Award. And we're thrilled to be welcoming Ashna to the team. Ashna, how are you this afternoon?

SPEAKER_02 2:12

I'm good, thank you. And I'm really excited to be joining you. Thanks.

SPEAKER_03 2:15

Our second addition to the team is Dr. Edward Miller. He's a stage two trainee from Auckland and New Zealand. And after graduating from Adelaide Uni, he spent the last five years in practising in the United Kingdom and he's achieved a Master's in Psychiatric Research from Oxford and also a Master's of Theoretical Psychoanalysis from the University College London. Edward's also interested in child and adolescent mental health, and he rounds off this very talented group of new new uh trainee editors. Welcome Ed to the team. Uh it's so good to have you here.

SPEAKER_01 2:46

Thanks very much, Ollie. I look forward to working with you and everyone over the coming uh year or so.

SPEAKER_03 2:51

Oh, it's uh it's good to have you here. I'll start probably with uh with Arshna, myself, Michael, and Andy are keen to know a little bit about uh what motivated you to join the team at Australian Psychiatry.

SPEAKER_02 3:02

Yeah, for sure. I guess my interaction with the research had always been on the submission side. So done a few meta-analyses, submitted those, done a bit of peer review, but I was really interested in learning the other part of research and looking at the curation of journals and how articles are accepted and getting to know the whole process better. Just um I think research is a really valuable vehicle for change, so I wanted to get amongst all of it.

SPEAKER_03 3:30

Actually, for those who don't know, I mean, I suppose you had to apply for this role throughout the end of 2022. Are you able to describe the process and what it was like for anyone who might be interested in the future?

SPEAKER_02 3:42

Yeah, it was actually um a really simple and quite lovely process. Uh I submitted an expression of interest. I saw a call out in one of the college newsletters, and then I think part of that was a statement and a CV, and then a while later got contacted by Bill from the journal and had a really lovely collegial interview, and then he went out.

SPEAKER_03 4:04

Oh, fantastic. That's so good. And it was the process similar to yourself or yeah, it was the exact same.

SPEAKER_01 4:11

I've been wanting to get involved in the journal publication uh and review process for a while. Um, I saw an opportunity thanks to the ad in one of the newsletters and uh applied the same process as um Ashna, put in a CV cover letter, had the interview, and was lucky enough to be appointed to the panel.

SPEAKER_03 4:33

Michael, uh, you and myself have been in this role for approximately 18 months now. Are you able to kind of describe to the guys what they can expect over the next little while as part of the team?

SPEAKER_00 4:44

Sure, Ollie. Yeah, it's quite a varied role being part of the journal. I mean, obviously our listeners will be familiar with the podcast, which we've been recording as a bi-monthly thing for most of that time, which has been a great experience. Our other things that we've been doing are sort of more related to, I suppose, the core nature of the journal with being involved as peer reviewers for articles that get submitted to the journal, particularly scholarly projects that trainees are submitting or other kind of general submissions. Yeah, I think as Ashna referenced before, that's quite an interesting perspective to have as well, to be able to, you know, think about submissions that come into the journal, what makes a good submission, how to give feedback and how to structure a review and how to be a part of that behind-the-scenes process, which otherwise haven't had an experience of doing. So that's been really interesting. One of the other opportunities that we had was to come along to Congress last year and present on some of the work that we've been doing, both with the podcast and with other projects, and that was great to meet yourself, Ollie, in person and uh have a chance to sort of share the work that we're doing, and we're heading back to Perth this year for the Congress. And probably the the last main project that we've worked on is uh a review of the back catalogue of the journal where we've went through and identified all the previous articles that had been published that could be relevant for trainees as they progress through fellowship and making a collection of those articles available on the website and trying to keep that as up to date as possible as time moves on and more articles get published for a trainee interest.

SPEAKER_03 6:18

So it's so good to have um some new people involved to continue the work that's been going on. I suppose when we started the podcast, one of the one of the ideas that we were working on and one of the hopes we have was to increase the connectivity between trainees across the states and also across the Tasman Sea, really, to bring um people in from New Zealand. Because training can sometimes feel a bit siloed, you know, you you're in your your own health service or you're in your own state, and you you rarely get to interact with people outside of those boundaries, but through the podcast we've been able to communicate with quite a number of people, and having Ed and Ashna from uh New South Wales and New Zealand respectively is is so exciting. I mean Ed, is that is that the kind of perception sometimes in New Zealand as well that you feel like you're you know maybe a bit isolated in that training network over there and you don't have as much contact with the with the trainees in Australia?

SPEAKER_01 7:04

Yeah, I think so. And being Australian myself, but living here in New Zealand now, yeah, it's an interesting sort of dynamic. New Zealand is obviously a separate country to Australia. There's lots of things that are in common between Australia and New Zealand, and having the same college is really valuable. Um, but there are differences between New Zealand as well, which is important to recognise, I guess, in the college systems and processes too.

SPEAKER_04 7:29

I was involved in the selection process, and we were very uh so Bill Shuichi and myself were extremely impressed by Ed and Ashna. And we had a number of other candidates who we haven't selected, but just the the energy and the focus of uh both of you guys was really impressive. And and um the amount of time that you indicated you were willing to devote to this sort of activity was also impressive. So I think very exciting for us to be a part of that. But I was hoping you might talk a little bit at yourselves about what you're hoping to bring and the particular content areas that you're uh interested in developing as we go along in the next year or so. I might might ask Ashna to start first.

SPEAKER_02 8:07

I think for me it's easy as a trainee to be very assessment focused. And so uh you lose sight of the ways that research can augment your clinical practice and just your thinking, but also your assessments as well, because that is clearly something that comes up. So I'd love to help trainees solidify that link between research and training or their future practice or their assessments and just make sure that people understand that they can take time to work on research, and that's not going to be a detriment to their training or to their career.

SPEAKER_04 8:41

Yeah, so look, it's it's one of the best learning experiences you can have. When you're writing a paper, as Ashano, I think you've indicated you've done a few, and Ed, I think you've been involved as well. But you have to think so intensely about the issues that it really forms that core of expertise in your head. So later on down the track, when you're involved in a similar sort of case or you know, a similar sort of patient population, um, you immediately have access not only to the paper that you've written, but all of the things you've relied upon to make that paper a reality. So I look, I agree. I have been a director of training, and I I think the experience that you have as a uh scholar practitioner trying to develop a scholarly project, for example, is probably one of the most intense and rewarding experiences you have ever trained. Ed, did you have any particular areas you'd like to uh to touch on?

SPEAKER_01 9:27

Yeah, I think for the podcast, I think one thing I'm really looking forward to is engaging the trainee sort of workforce and the trainee cohort um as a whole. You know, helping that trainee voice to really come through as being a valuable and important part of the whole kind of college experience. Because it's easy to think that you're a trainee, what you think in feel and say isn't really that important, you kind of write down the bottom of the rungs. But you know, we have a really important part in the workforce and we do a lot of really good work. So, in order to help people to have access to information, to have a voice, to feel like they're actually really contributing to development within the sort of college community, I think is really important.

SPEAKER_04 10:11

Absolutely, music to my ears, uh Ed. And I think I think we discussed some similar issues in your initial interview.

SPEAKER_03 10:18

So Ashley, you're quite, you know, early on in your training journey and uh just about to finish your first year, which is a massive milestone. So congratulations, that's that's huge. Reflecting on the year, is there anything that stands out that's been particularly positive?

SPEAKER_02 10:32

Absolutely. I mean, like I've had a lot of fun all year. There's a really nice feeling when you join a training program and you're like, yeah, this is definitely the right choice. Like I'm really vibing what I do every day. I did start off by going rural, so I went to Tweedheads for six months and worked in the inpatient unit there and had the best time. I absolutely adored it. All the stuff on the inpatient unit were just fantastic. My supervisor was amazing, the beaches and the weather was remarkable. I was gonna ask if that was a surfing-related decision if you I personally don't surf, but I do love to watch people surf. Um I'm sort of I'm I'm like a I'm beach adjacent, maybe. So it was a remarkable experience and a really great way to dive in.

SPEAKER_03 11:16

Oh, that's awesome. And uh and then what did you end up doing in the second half of the year?

SPEAKER_02 11:21

I'm at Prince of Wales at the moment in acute adult impatient psychiatry again, and I did my JMO years at PAL, so I feel very much at home and I'm so glad to be back.

SPEAKER_04 11:30

Inner city tends to be fairly intense. Is that a is that an intense rotation?

SPEAKER_02 11:34

Yeah, I guess it is. I mean, some of it's different, you know, Tweed was at times quite under-resourced, and there was maybe I probably saw more substance-related presentations, and you didn't, you know, we didn't have easy access to a MICU, so like anything that came through the door we were handling in this fairly small unit compared to a more resource tertiary hospital. Uh, but it's it's different in its own way for sure.

SPEAKER_03 12:00

I'm sure there were many, many reasons driving the decision, but sort of when you were doing a JMO years, what was it about psychiatry that drew you to join the club?

SPEAKER_02 12:09

I just I really I loved everyone that I met in psych. I went to a psych congress um and we were having all the conversations that I wanted to be having. I felt like it was a really holistic specialty. I enjoyed the blend of the psychiatric side of things with the more physical medical side of things, and definitely part of it was fuelled by that classic sort of like, oh, it's a waste that you're going into psychiatry and anytime I hear that I get so angry. So I was so just stoked to be joining psych and to be proving everyone else wrong as I think.

SPEAKER_03 12:47

I can uh I was reflecting on a similar conversation I had this morning when I was uh walking my dog that I had a supervisor, I won't name the hospital or location, who said, Oh, you this is such a waste, you'll be out of it in five years. And I just don't think that's true. So um it's funny how many of us get that kind of well, I wouldn't hazard to call it advice, but um, you know, those kind of comments they do follow us around sometimes as JMOs.

SPEAKER_02 13:09

It definitely feels like people are sort of sleeping on psychiatry. Like I think if more people did JMO rotations, they would realize what like an enriching and wonderful specialty it is. At Tweed, I had three JMOs, and by the end of the term, two of them ended up applying for psych.

SPEAKER_03 13:26

So that's great. Well, in in Victoria, they've recently uh made it compulsory for all GMOs to rotation as an intern uh through psychiatry, which is a great initiative. So we'll see see how that turns out over the next few years. Ed, is there anything that sticks out for yourself in training so far?

SPEAKER_01 13:42

Probably the thing worth mentioning is that as you as you get more senior and you get more responsibility and you are able to make decisions on your own, it actually becomes a lot more rewarding because you have that responsibility and you actually start to be able to do things, you realise that you can actually help people and seeing people actually get better and hearing you know positive feedback from patients, from from families, being able to work with you know staff in a particular unit and work together, come to solution, it's actually incredibly, incredibly rewarding. And you know, in some ways it gets hard as you become more senior, but with that uh I guess with the the increased risk and responsibility you carry, you actually it it does actually start to become more rewarding as well.

SPEAKER_03 14:27

Interesting perspective, and I think something certainly I felt going through, and I'm sure Michael has had somewhat similar experiences.

SPEAKER_00 14:34

What rotation are you doing at the moment, Edward?

SPEAKER_01 14:36

Yeah, so I'm in North Shore Hospital in Auckland at the moment, um, and I'm in an inpatient adult rotation.

SPEAKER_03 14:44

It's such a pleasure to have some new voices and new talent on board with the show. We're really excited for where things are going to go in 2023, and we're looking forward to providing you, our listeners, with updates on where we're headed in the very near future. I'd like to also take the opportunity to formally acknowledge Michael's admission to the college as a fellow in 2022. We just, as a team, want to give you a huge congratulations, Michael, for completing uh your training. Uh, and it's really great that you've decided to stick on the panel and and hang around uh to give us the uh perspective of an early career psychiatrist. So thank you so much.

SPEAKER_00 15:18

Thanks, Ellie. Appreciate it, and really pleased to be able to stick around and keep doing the fun stuff like the podcast.

SPEAKER_03 15:24

Yeah, that's good. And um Andy, as always, thank you so much for joining us today and and uh always giving us so much of your time and generosity to be a part of the team. So we really really appreciate it.

SPEAKER_04 15:35

Oh, it's a great pleasure, Ollie. Thanks for having me.

SPEAKER_03 15:37

Thank you to Ed and Ashner. Uh we'll see you guys next time.

SPEAKER_02 15:41

Thanks, Ollie. Looking forward to it.

SPEAKER_03 15:43

And then lastly, thank you to David Beale and Nishta Kuma who uh support us in producing the show. We'd like to say a farewell and thank you to Joe Rose Faito, who has moved on to other roles. Uh, we thank her for all the efforts last year. And then lastly, we thank Australasian Psychiatry for the opportunity, Sidoni Apprentice for our artwork and Chatty Day for our music. Uh, we'd encourage all of our listeners uh to rate and review us on their relevant podcasting app. And you can contact us at any time, uh, our email address, thethoughtbroadcast.podcast at ranzcp.org. So please feel free to contact us via email. You can also get us through the Australasian psychiatry Twitter handle, uh, and that those messages will be forwarded on to us. We love hearing from listeners. We've generated episodes from listener feedback and suggestions, and we'd really be keen to do so in the future and hoping to uh include more of you in our conversations. Uh so that's it from all of us. My name is Ollie Robertson, and we uh will see you next time.